Thank you for your comments, Gary.

“But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.” If we but had only “common sense” or just “carnal reasoning”, we would be doomed to our God-less thoughts. “Common” sense reasoning is limited, and is what separates us; therefore, it cannot be the instrument by which we are reconciled in our thinking.

What we can do is lay out the Scriptural basis for our belief sincerely, and let a sincere skeptic consider and receive or reject “revelation”; the higher source of understanding that comes via God’s Spirit-given intuitive sense, which first questions or confronts “common” sense. Common sense is the very limited and most obstructive source for obtaining spiritual understanding by those living in this World. Carnal reasoning, such as the things mentioned in your statement, is natural or common, and is the enemy of the skeptic as well as the believer. It is limited solely to the “intellectual reasoning” of the mind. It is the wisdom of this World, as opposed to the mind renewed to the “Word”/Wisdom of God our Creator.

The Word of God graciously came initially to each of us believers on a very basic level. That of presenting to our “hearts” the message that we are inherently sinners by virtue of being the corrupted seed of our forefather Adam, and stand in need of a Savior from the kingdom and nature of satan. Millions of human beings, over thousands of years, have heard that call of God, and that in spite of all the sufferings of man and common sense reasonings against it, and experienced being, what is called, “born-again.” This experience is described as an internal spiritual one, as nothing in their appearance has necessarily changed from the outside. This is in harmony with the Biblical doctrine of man being a triad being: Adam was created… “good, very good…” as a “living soul” with an animated spirit which predominantly guided him in his existence, both encased within a physical body. And now everyone, as the seed of fallen Adam, as a consequence, is born into this World, a living soul, with certain common faculties: Mind, will, emotion, imagination, and intellect, with an unanimated spirit wherein is located: Conscience, communion, and intuitiveness, both encased in our physical Body, with its physical senses: See, taste, hear, smell and feel. This is the makeup of a human being. And because his spirit is unanimated when he is born into this World, he is controlled by his other faculties, to one degree or another. Being “born-again” describes our having our spirit reanimated; whereby the attentive may grow in spiritual understanding through the revelation of His Word. As a result, our intellect is no longer totally reliant upon our carnal senses and its knowledge, but is augmented by the spirit/Spirit faculty as well. This allows the intellect of the mind to be renewed or instructed to the Truth (the Word of God).

This persuading of God ever-working on fallen man is the basis of being “born-again”. That “baby-like” rebirth of a faculty beyond intellectual that initially overrides “common sense.” But often, just after the experience, the intellect inevitably begins to interrogate the rationality of such a faith based belief. And in its immature stage, with yet un-renewed mind, if pressed up, cannot explain to common sense why it must now give faith-filled consideration to Scripture, that clearly opposes common sense reasoning!

Maybe a very simple Scriptural example of this is when Eve’s mind was confronted with the intellectual reasoning of this question: “Hath God really said?” The question was aimed at the intellect; purposefully to question her yet unsubstantiated thinking — understanding and set it at odds with God’s clearly recognized directive. And in that she did not fully yet comprehend God’s purpose for that directive, when being confronted with the lying misrepresentation, posed as a question to her innocent but immature intellect, it seemed plausible. (This being a very over-simplified description of what was surely a very highly sophisticated discussion.) Trust in God, in which she was equipped outside of intellectual reasoning, would have directed her differently. This would have presumably precipitated more communion with God followed by a deeper understanding, based upon revelation.

Here is where the skeptic has bought in, solely reliant on the intellect or common sense, which unknowingly is resisting the still small voice of faith appealing to the flicker of life in the spirit, outside the restrictive intellect of the World. (As most of us born-again millions did before we yielded to the persuading of the Spirit of God to receive Him into our hearts.) As to how this relates to reconciling the skeptic, to our Creator: The Loving and Almighty God, in His allowance of evil sufferings, is then through Scripture, the means by which we believers were reconciled. But the skeptic says: “How can you trust the Scriptures as the basis and standard for truth? It was written by men, it is full of error and contradictions.” To this we might respond: It has survived the test of millions over millenniums; some of the most brilliant thinking skeptics have set out to disprove the validity of its statements, and upon examination, become its strongest supporters. Within its pages, in spite of any man’s flaws, lies the unalterable truth with the inherent power of God, quickly discerned by the sincere heart seeking truth.

It is discovered within its pages, that it is God’s own given, written witness of Himself to mankind and the World. It is the standard by which all commentaries of Him must be weighed. In it is found the reasons of our creation, the current state of our being, and our future destinies. There are many Believers, who like Eve, are confronted with the wisdom of this World, and are without the understanding of some of God’s declarations, and purposes. But unlike Eve, they intuitively maintain the integrity of His Word in their heart (spirit-controlled mind and will) and reject the tempting appeal to their carnal reasoning. Sadly, for some Believers, (and some sincere non-believers, and woe to the skeptic who is the obstructionist) the “polished” skeptic, well-versed in the reasonings of the world, influence them, and obstruct them in their pursuit of truth. And will cause some of them to ship-wreck their faith and thereby lose the inheritance promised to the overcoming of the World, who are faith-filled with His Word and Wisdom.

To speak to the Scriptural and revealed apologetics of “why God does allow sufferings” would take up far more time and space allowed here. But an overview of this subject and issues similar to this can be found in our teachings or on our website, to address the skeptic and inform the uninformed Believer. The student or skeptic of the Bible, after having read the notes attached to each lesson, may then further explore the subjects by listening to the teachings where the answers may be found.

Such as that God created the Angels before man, and that they were in close proximity to Him, some being closer than others. Of whom we discover Lucifer; a great and gifted Cherub before God. Who having been “created” an Angel spirit, with free will to think and act, as man, a living soul, was later created, and chose through self-pride to rebel against God. The penalty of which was not loss of existence, but the loss of quality of existence. An existence described as “death” or the state absent of God-like life, in that now he is everything God is not, and was banned from residence in His presence. Wherein it is supposed and somewhat supported that he had an association and something to do with the pre-Adamic Earth that was discovered to us in the 2nd verse of Genesis 1 “…without form and void…” And in his fall, was relegated to the earth and heavens associated with it.

Scripture describes him as the adversary and great deceiver, satan, the devil, the serpent, the father of lies, a thief, a liar and a murderer. He is the author of all evil. God declares in His Word, although He created Lucifer and cursed him and the earth, it is not He who is the author of wickedness in the World in which we currently live, but satan and those who follow him. These things beginning long before man was created, and not then fully dealt with. In that satan, although cast out of Heaven, is characterized in Scripture as the god of this world, and the prince of the power of the atmosphere in which we exist.

And how did he get this authority?

Scripture declares that it was gotten from Adam and Eve. Eve by deception, but Adam was not deceived, nevertheless followed his wife into this “death”. That death, first in the day of his rebellion experienced in his spirit, and then following, as a consequence of his spirit’s death, years later in the physical body’s death. All these things answering to why we humans are cursed, and pass from this world after a short existence. The Earth and all that is in it is God’s. But the World and all that is in it is satan’s. We live on the cursed earth in the World of satan as a consequence of satan’s fall and then later, one man’s action, that caused us to follow him into death. It has been proclaimed by man and satan from Adam’s “death” that God is the blame (if there even is a God) for all man’s suffering. But God lays the blame for man’s (and the earth’s) demise first at satan’s feet.

The natural, reasonable, common sense question becomes…. If God is Love and He is all powerful why did He allow this event and all the atrocities following? And since common sense; carnal reasoning, which is a product of the fall, and is at enmity with God, cannot come up with the answer. (Nor can it in itself alone comprehend it even when it is told.) Then the reasonable conclusion is that God, as the Holy Bible portrays, is non-existent.

That “God is Love” is proven in that He promised Adam He would send a Savior that would crush the serpent’s head/authority in this Earth. And He did… Jesus, His Own unique and only Begotten Son, Who born into this World, took on the flesh of man and in various extreme ways SUFFERED willingly for the redemption of man. Which speaks to; not only is God Love, but He is equally Holy and Just. Who, then having overcome satan/World in His righteous death, was resurrected from among the dead, and has now, through that Atonement, finally condemned satan and his followers to eternal exclusion from His soon coming New Restored Kingdom, which speaks to; not only is God Love, Holy and Just, but full of Wisdom.

And is Lovingly, Holy and Justly, by His Wisdom through that same Atonement, uniquely calling out many sons to share in His future Kingdom, from this World; acquired by faith (not by naïve ignorance) in that Atonement. Who willingly follow Jesus Christ’s commands, unto suffering as He did, in the even worsening World circumstances. Being willing to share in His sufferings in the denial of His own will along with the sufferings of the World’s threats and temptations. And all this as the Earth and World serve out the time of God’s Just Curse upon it. He calls out of it Mercifully, granting His Grace/Divine influence within His obediently seeking children. Who are thereby uniquely qualified to share in His future Kingdom not only free from all sufferings, but with the opportunity through that willing suffering, to become His special consort Bride to rule and reign with Him for a thousand years in the Earth, replacing the existing World’s authority. And then when God creates the New Heavens and New Earth, they are assured of a residence in the Heavenly New Jerusalem.

This calling out of faith in faithful sons, believing without seeing, can only be accomplished in this most dark World’s temptations and terrors. And is that work of the Holy Spirit by the Word of God brought to bear on man in his renewed/born-again spirit. All now directly answering to God’s Majesty in Almighty Power, Love, Holiness, Justness, Mercy, and Wisdom that culminated in the Atonement of Jesus Christ, the Son of God and Son of Man. When He comes again, all the sufferings will soon be forgotten in His comfort. All those who mourn, the abused, the meek, those who hunger and thirst for righteousness and who are the persecuted…. all who would be godly will suffer in this World. Let not the religious or unbelieving trust in their religious or worldly reasonings, for nothing will go un-judged, and nothing unrecompensed. But He will fully and righteously judge this wicked World and those who inspire it, and stand contrary as obstructionists to His purposes, both spirit-beings and earthly beings. And He promises He will finally put an end to the last enemy; the perpetuation of “death.”

So, we see “sufferings” in this World are experienced in those two very different ways. Those atrocities that are initiated in the spirit of the World, of which not one person who lives or has ever lived has not experienced to one degree or another. And the other “sufferings” are those that God’s sons willingly and patiently endure in the pursuit of living a Jesus Christ-directed selfless life. That can include the sufferings of the spirit of the World, but most assuredly must suffer the internal struggle against all the fallen carnal characteristics of the fallen sin nature of satan, which God intentionally left within every born-again believer. That he is required to “….overcome him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the Word of their testimony: and they loved not their lives unto the death.”

We see then what is absent from common sense is the Scriptural revelation of God’s justice and holiness as opposed to His mercy and loving kindness. In how that Jesus Christ’s Atonement alone answers to all His attributes, and through it, God now ordains all things, and in the order of His set times revealed in Scripture. All the Wisdom and Majesty is set there in His Word to be discovered by the sincere seeker.

What is being inspired by the Liar and promoted by skeptics and atheists who decry the atrocities of this World, as the answer to the “existence of God” question; in that if there was an Almighty God, He would not allow it! Which is essentially the denying of God His Holiness and Justness, and declaring our God as impotent. Christendom’s weak and often unintelligible answer to this is God is “Love” (as if that is all He is) and it is the devil who is solely responsible for all the evil in the Earth, and to the greater part without further Scriptural understanding, to which the skeptics and atheists in like manner declare this God impotent as well or a liar, for if He was Loving and all powerful he would not allow such things. But God is not mocked, and whatever a man sows, that he will also reap. His Justice will prevail. 2 Corinthians 5:10…. “For we must all appear before the judgment seat of Christ; that every one may receive the things done in his body, according to that he hath done, whether it be good or bad.”

Essentially the skeptic or unbeliever is declaring: We don’t want or believe in that Holy God and His Justness, nor an impotent Loving God that would allow such violence. Declaring, we would have our own World wherein we may exercise our free will, and that even if it is a displeasure and affront to our Creator, and that without any of His severe correction or rebuke. We want a World free from the restraints of God and full of the pleasures of the flesh (but only those less violent veins of sin) where such violent wickedness as rape or murder or torture is not present. Or we want an indifferent God; who really doesn’t care that much one way or another how we are (but should keep a better lid on things.)

Not recognizing that within their very selves that they may find the like darkness of nature, but that may not manifest. But where one wickedness may be checked, another oozes out another place. And all are causes or contributors of myriads of other sufferings that are currently in the World. There is no place or people, past, now, or in the future, left alone to themselves, without God, that have not or will not gravitate to the wickedness of satan himself. For if it were not for the kernel of spirit-life; that little spark of conscience, which God both lovingly and answering to His Justness, left in every man, we would be exactly like satan himself. We would be void of conscience, irreconcilable and bound for incarceration and exclusion, within the holy eternal fires of judgment.

Man, in general, has not recognized that the state of things in the Earth are ordered by both the Loving Mercy and Holy Justice of God. Because they foolishly choose not to stand in the light of His Word and recognize the exceedingly sinfulness of sin, not just in the World, but inside us all. And because of this unwillingness, they cannot be capacitated by the revelation of God, and remain small in their thinking. All the while, they are deceived and being deceivers. They think the common sense ground they stand on is so sure. If but they would explore the Word of God themselves and stand in the light of it, then being capacitated, they would humbly appreciate both the severity and goodness of God extended currently and temporarily, in the timetable of God, to mankind, to fulfill His Son’s Atonement purpose in the restoration of man.

There should be only one way to reason with a Christian. That is by the Word of God, comparing Scripture to Scripture. And when we speak, although we might be accused of narrow mindedness, we have no other ground on which we may take a firm stand. To reason with a Believer by any other means should be rejected.